Curse

Sword · Dec 04, 2006, 07:48 AM // 07:48

ive only skimmed over a few comments, and felt it was necessary to make one ... as some1 who commits alot of time into getting as skillful as possible in this game I find it pathetic that any1 who commits any decent amount of time on this game to complain that something is too hard... maybe you should learn the game instead of press c+spacebar on your warrior...look at the skills, read them, think of what skills go well together and can counter what the game throws against you (be it pvp or pve), just because alot of people run thumpers or searing flames dosent mean you have to...these are easy builds to run, dedicate some time and learn how to play a better build; ask around , hell even make one yourself. If you put some effort to learn the game then maybe you will find it more enjoyable and you will get better.

Kha · Dec 04, 2006, 07:49 AM // 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaglorD

You know what I think. Anet added this area to stop ppl from complaining GW gets boring once you finish the main quest.

Sad if true. If they wanted people to not be bored after doing the main storyline, they should add something new and unique, not the end area all over again but this time on steroids.

Ulivious The Reaper · Dec 04, 2006, 08:05 AM // 08:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kha

Sad if true. If they wanted people to not be bored after doing the main storyline, they should add something new and unique, not the end area all over again but this time on steroids.

we got what we asked for, an elite area, AND if i rememebr right back from Factions this elite area is much less repettetive, atleast the area in general looks unique to the rest of the area, not 12 rooms of same skinned gothic area or jade (dont' get me wrong they were nice looking), but still, i can't wait to get my mesmer there (Seeing my warriors got to much competition)

Nexus Icon · Dec 04, 2006, 08:09 AM // 08:09

I don't think it's elite, or hard, just cheap.
It's a quick-fix, appease-the-hardcore, sloppy solution.
Missions don't HAVE to be 5 hours long to provide a challenge. I'm sorry, but wasting my time playing poorly designed content with little to no reward at the end isn't going to happen.
ANet have proven in the past that missions CAN be challenging without having to invest a huge amount of time; indeed, they sold they whole game initially on the premise of player skill being more valuable than time spent playing.
Let's look at examples of decent challenges that don't require a huge investment of time and sloppy, aggravating trial-and-error gameplay:

Dunes of Despair Bonus: To achieve this (without relying on the hit-or-miss traversal/rebirth exploit) requires a good degree of teamwork and an open and frank discussion of tactics at the start of the mission, otherwise you WILL fail. But the mission itself takes a maximum of 30 minutes. A fantastic example.

Eternal Grove Bonus: Again, to get the bonus requires careful planning and all players involved have to be on their toes to ensure that all of the objective NPCs survive. And yet again, you don't spend 5 hours doing this, it's another 30 minute mission.

Gyala Hatchery Bonus: Keeping those baby turtles alive requires a good team effort with a big opportunity for it to go tits up if concentration lapses. Again, 30 minutes.

I could go on, and indeed, most of the examples I would use would be bonus missions, but my point stands: these missions require skill, not endless amounts of free time.
All that DoA requires is stamina. It's a WoW raid wannabe, where the devs try and force players to spend huge chunks of time there.

So to all of these people who think they are "Elite" for having the mindless persistence to keep trying DoA, I laugh at you. You really are playing the wrong game, and by crying that it shouldn't change, you're really saying that all you want is WoW on the cheap.

And to the devs: Must try harder. D-
Don't keep trying to make your customers think that hundreds of over-powered mobs with unbalanced monster skills in uninspired, recycled maps featuring cheap environmental effects is a valid way to make good end-game content.
Pull your collective fingers out and use yer bloody brains. You've proven in the past that you can do it, so do it now.

Solar Light · Dec 04, 2006, 08:25 AM // 08:25

now i understand why DoA came faster then expected, it was put together quick and sloppy.

unspokenglory · Dec 04, 2006, 08:27 AM // 08:27

All you have told us is that you are unable to beat it and instead of tring you luagh at us who are making progress and are having fun ?.. i [pitty you .. stop look at thegame and enjoy it .. i would agree alot do not like this quest updates should be made but in the end it gives alot of people who dont find some of the bonus missions you find challanging .. (challanging ..) and now they do .. so stop griping and whining about somthing you can not comlpete .. and dont get all pissy about those who do keep tring and i bet 89% of them will get closer and clsoer intill they beat it .. and the satasfaction of beating it is a reward in it's self so i say to you nexus .. if you can not handle then heat get out the kitchen .. (its a game have fun .. its not life ^_^)

Nexus Icon · Dec 04, 2006, 08:33 AM // 08:33

Believe me, I already have gotten "out of the kitchen", having quickly realised that DoA is a complete waste of time.
And the point is, I could beat it if I were willing to spend endless waking hours playing it, but there's the rub:I don't WANT to dedicate my life to beating a badly designed mission in an online game.
And if you REALLY think you're making progress, I'm afraid I feel nothing but pity for you.
Tell you what, there's a wall behind you. How about you go and bang your head against it?
I guarantee that given enough time you should be able to make it to the other side!

fatmouse · Dec 04, 2006, 08:37 AM // 08:37

Don't worry noobs, I'm sure if you wait long enough someone will make you a nice cookie cutter build where you can click mindlessly on a couple of skills for 5 hours and beat the quests. Then you can come back and tell us how you have nothing left to do because the game is too easy, right?

Amity and Truth · Dec 04, 2006, 08:41 AM // 08:41

Yes Nexus, please, troll some more. We'd really like to see more insults coming from you.

Nexus Icon · Dec 04, 2006, 08:46 AM // 08:46

Not trolling, just stating what I perceive to be fact as so many other people are doing.
If I'm trolling, try and disprove my argument that there's more to creating challenge in a game than requiring an inordinate investment of time...

Thallandor · Dec 04, 2006, 09:14 AM // 09:14

After reading the last 30 pages on this thread, there were several things which i am thankful for:

1)Favor wasnt needed to enter the area. They make Komir spawn 24/7 now each time you kneel before her statue giving everyone fair excess as long you completed the game.

2)Heros are allowed in the Area even though Hencies are not. Fair enough, its a compromise. Granted that Hencies probably wont have been helpful in there in the first place.

3)Making DoA challenging. Before DoA, there have been complaints of the decline of PuG and the game getting too easy with Heros+Henchies. Now with DoA, the urge to form proper PuGs/Groups with players who know their place in the party well with the willingness to cooperate for long durations with specific goals have never been more important. As for DoA being easy and boring, i dont think i need to elaborate. If anything, most of us here have to remember that we reap what we sow.

4)The community that share information/build. I will still be looking out for the cookie cutter group that will hopefully appear. Meanwhile those that are sharing info, keep up the good work.

Angel Develin · Dec 04, 2006, 09:24 AM // 09:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thallandor

After reading the last 30 pages on this thread, there were several things which i am thankful for:

1)Favor wasnt needed to enter the area. They make Komir spawn 24/7 now each time you kneel before her statue giving everyone fair excess as long you completed the game.

I do not see this as a big plus point, you only need to enter 1 time and you unlock the mission area.

Karlos · Dec 04, 2006, 09:26 AM // 09:26

Regarding this whole "ZOMG It's only beatable by a few speicifc builds and professions"...

This is completely false. And people saying this have simply not beaten it with their character and want to attribute the failure to someone other than themselves or their teams. Get the rest of your chars through the game, and learn more builds for your failed chars.

I have beaten the city 3 times, in total, I have played with EVERY profession. i.e. ALL professions have completed the City in my presence:

Eles (8), Monks(7), Warriors(1), Ritualist(1), Mesmer(1), Paragon(1), Dervish(1), Necromancer(2), Ranger(1) and ZOMG even Assassins(1).

So, stop your complaining and your stereotyping and go figure out why it has not worked for you.

Granted, some classes will have it easier than others (note the ratios I listed above, 33% eles), but I must say, ALL The guys I have been with had one thing in common, they EACH knew how to run a build to help the situation. The Assassin and the Dervish ran a BRILLIANT tanking build. Made them invincible.

What they did NOT have is a tried and true build from Kourna to the Realm of Torment that they EXPECTED to work in the Domain of Anguish.

Shanaeri Rynale · Dec 04, 2006, 09:29 AM // 09:29

It's been 3 days and we have a 1000+ response thread with people moaning about it. If no one has gotten anywhere near completing it in a month then maybe the difficulty should be looked at, but it's only been 3 days.

Fast food, McDonalds gaming mentality.

Anyway, I know i've been outspoken especially about favor and some other issues(security being another) but I try and put myself in the dev's place.

They worked hard for the DoA, celebrated it's completion and were looking forward to seeing people dying, trying again working things out in a fun way. Intead they get moans and whinges it must make them feel as tho they wont bother next time.

I really honestly believe that AN would not have designed this place so that only a team comprised of X, Y and Z can complete it. There are builds being used, or yet to be discovered that will include the so called unwanted classes.

It just needs time, and thought. I suspect they built this area especially to last us until ch4 be that April Or August. So let's not rush, take the time and help each other out trying to figure it out.

unspokenglory · Dec 04, 2006, 09:38 AM // 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karlos

Regarding this whole "ZOMG It's only beatable by a few speicifc builds and professions"...

This is completely false. And people saying this have simply not beaten it with their character and want to attribute the failure to someone other than themselves or their teams. Get the rest of your chars through the game, and learn more builds for your failed chars.

I have beaten the city 3 times, in total, I have played with EVERY profession. i.e. ALL professions have completed the City in my presence:

Eles (8), Monks(7), Warriors(1), Ritualist(1), Mesmer(1), Paragon(1), Dervish(1), Necromancer(2), Ranger(1) and ZOMG even Assassins(1).

So, stop your complaining and your stereotyping and go figure out why it has not worked for you.

Granted, some classes will have it easier than others (note the ratios I listed above, 33% eles), but I must say, ALL The guys I have been with had one thing in common, they EACH knew how to run a build to help the situation. The Assassin and the Dervish ran a BRILLIANT tanking build. Made them invincible.

What they did NOT have is a tried and true build from Kourna to the Realm of Torment that they EXPECTED to work in the Domain of Anguish.

^_^ exactly .. i have to agree one this this elite mission has taught me is to sit down and think of a build for my warrior that would hold asggro and keep me alive while others kill the mob .. after a day of thinking and calculating on what could happen if i usesed this skill would work and help defend my team from this skill etc.. and omg what sdo you know i succeded in doing just that .. as i run with 1,400+hp a stance to keep me up from being knocked down and a skill to recharge my energy when mantra doesnt work as fast as i want it to .. and bam i keep aggro as 2-3 nukers spike the mob and a 1-2 rangers spam there spuirits and the monks heal like no tomorrow ^_^ it was acomplished got past the castle and killed by the last mob in there .. but far better then i was before i decided to think and learn a build that would help the team !! think about it .. we all can do it .. all ya got to do is try ^_^

Mogster · Dec 04, 2006, 09:56 AM // 09:56

I spent 3+ hours in anguish last night playing my R/Mo using GC and winter as well as EoE which worked like a charm untill we got waylayed in a lil trap, doing breaching the stygian veil, third or fouth quest i think it was. since i was keeping spirits alive etc. single warrior puleld agro then eles nuked once agro was obtained.

this works well for this quest it seams dont know about the others though still refigning it, maby more party benefiting spirits maby Rit etc might help since youd be out the line of combat. my 2 cents

Cebe · Dec 04, 2006, 10:12 AM // 10:12

Ok, so me and an alliance member came up with an idea for a team build...any comments or suggestions welcome.

I seems to me that if you can keep them shut down they might not be so bad...

1 Ritualist with Earthbind / Binding Chains / Union / Shelter..

1 Necro with Soul Bind & Spammable hexes

1 Ele with Thunderclap (ZOMG!) / Blinding Flash..

1 Ranger with Choking Gas

1 Ele for generic nuking.

1 "Tank"

2 Monks.

It was the top 4 that are the important ones. The idea was to keep things shut down as much as much as possible. Thunderclap, Soul Bind (and Dragon's Stomp / Meteor Shower from the second ele) knocks down, Earthbind keeps them down. Binding Chains can stop some from attacking...until they take damage so you need to tell your wammo to resist the desire to stab them with their FDS. Choking Gas can obviously interrupt. I would have the Air ele take skills like Blinding Flash so as to further support the team as if they spam most air skills Thunderclap will leave them with no energy.

Anyway, is just an idea. Any thoughts?

natano · Dec 04, 2006, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Just finished Veil mission,, finished the city one yesterday,
Its not that hard as ppl are saying it is. Yes, if you make a mistake you can cause you whole team to fail in a blink of an eye, but hey everybody who goes into these missions has to at least know the basic skills they teach you in training at the begining of the game.
All it takes is a good war who can aggro properly, and casters who know wen to attack.. dont attack while the war only has 1 monster on him , wait till he aggros all then attack , aswell you need competent monks.
It takes a long time, about 3-5 hours to complete but hell if the team is good you will succeed.

So join Pugs, stay with them, dont rage quit and have a bit of patience and you will see that its not that hard once you get the hang of it.
Im sure these quests can be done in under 2 hours.. PPl just need to fine tune the spots to aggro.
Give it a couple of days. You will see more ppl finishing these quests and at the end you will all be able to aswell.

Just wanted to add the build we ran

2 R/me - 1 R/Me was CG the other was spirit/trapper.
1 SF Ele with echo ms - energy was not a problem
1 N/me - bip
3 monks - 1 active prot , 1 heal, 1 bonder
1 W/A

Worked fine on both veil and city.
yet to try it on rest.

Dark Divinor · Dec 04, 2006, 10:23 AM // 10:23

On paper, it seems effective. The idea of shutting them down seems brilliant, even if it is simple. Bt who said all good ideas have to be complex?

Anyway, I'd say - with some slight tweaking here and there - that could be promising build for DoA. What I also *love* about it, is that it isn't 8 players of the same class. SF Ele anyone?

explodemyheart · Dec 04, 2006, 10:26 AM // 10:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexus Icon

If I'm trolling, try and disprove my argument that there's more to creating challenge in a game than requiring an inordinate investment of time...

What could they have done instead to make it worth your time?